What Would You Say If

[Kathi49]

Your doctor (in my case, my Neurologist) said to you...

1) Figure out your own tapering schedule.
2) Benzodiazepene withdrawal was..."all in my head".

Number one was due to the fact that I had to correct her not once but twice on a tapering schedule that was wrong based on my current dosage which she couldn't or didn't remember.

Number two was when I was prompting her to recall what had happened when I attempted to withdraw from Klonopin the first time (ER and all of that). Since she INSISTS that I am on a small dose this should not have happened, I asked her why, then, did this happen because I was following her tapering schedule TO THE LETTER. And that was the answer the I received!

And there is more to this story. In any case I was asking her or rather telling her I would like to try to taper again and my reasons why. Needless to say...not a good day. :(

[Mark N]

Kathi, you bad girl, challenging your doctor like that;). Clearly she KNOWS there is no taper needed and therefore shouldn't have you asking for one. The good news is she will let you establish your own taper and prescribe appropriately. I would be upset with her approach but glad she lets you choose.

[Kathi49]

I hope that was sarcasm Mark LOL! :

[Boxerlover]

Hey Kathi, did your doc have a bad day or something? Dang! I really hate these docs, seriously. All she would have had to say to me was "it was only in my head" and things would have hit the fan. No doc should be able to say that unless they are dealing with someone who has a big history with things like that. I was patted on the head and shoo'd out the door while they were thinking it was all in my head for years and to this day I want to show them see, see what you missed!

Gggrrr!!!

[Mark N]

Kathi, of course it was sarcasm:D. I do think the silver lining is that she is willing to let you set the taper schedule though. I do think she must of have a bad day or she has a bad bed side manner.

[Kathi49]

Melissa,

Grrr is right. ;)

I have said before that she can be very moody. But I was in no mood either because I had a wait of two hours while sitting on my very painful messed up tailbone not to mention the pelvic floor dysfunction. But that is not why I went. This was just a follow up; I usually have one every 6 months or so.

You are right when she said "all in my head", I about hit the roof but maintained and simply told her...you have the ER report in my chart. So, as I said there is more to this story. I think she got frustrated when I told her that the dosage and tapering schedule was wrong. It really was! I'll put it this way. I take .75 mg of Klonopin a day and split the 0.5 tablet in half and take an extra quarter at night. The way she had the tapering schedule written was 0.5 in the am and pm. So, that was more than I what I actually take. Then she realized that and tried to rewrite it again but it was still wrong. That's when she told me to figure it out myself. To me, THAT was wrong! She really should have taken the time to sort through it all. And she didn't.

So, then I mentioned Klonopin wafers. Why I even had to bring it up was beyond me. She should have just volunteered it. In any case they come in .125 mg. And would be much easier than trying to cut these things. So, she was fine with that. And I told her I wanted to do this very, very slowly.

Then she mentions Fairbanks Hospital. The place people go to wean off anything and everything. I told her I had been in contact with them the morning I was in severe withdrawals. THEY were the ones that told me to get to the ER right away. Which again, is why she has the daggone report. Yeah, right...all in my head! LOL

So, now we get to the part where she thinks going to them and becoming an inpatient is the best thing to do. Uh, huh, I am thinking...okay, let's just pawn me off on them. To be fair I realize what she was saying because this is dangerous stuff. But at the same time I was thinking....fine, don't take responsibility for the meds YOU put me on. So, I told her, I do NOT have the luxury of going inpatient for however many weeks it takes. Not at this point in time anyway because my husband is traveling right now and will be for the next several weeks. Once he stops traveling for awhile, sure, I could go in.

Anyway, I called Fairbanks yesterday and yes, I would have to go inpatient. When I told THEM the whole story they were flabbergasted...trust me on that. So, they gave me the names of two other doctors that could really help me with this. I didn't have time to contact them yesterday but will try today.

Oh, and one more thing. She wanted to add Abilify as I tapered off. I know nothing about Abilify. :rolleyes:

So, there it is.

Mark, I would agree with you if this wasn't such serious stuff. It is not the same thing as tapering or withdrawing from opiates.

[Smithc]

I would be really upset. Sounds like you handled it well. You are right, this is serious stuff.

Sounds like your doc was all pressured for time and running late. I feel bad for the docs when their practices or insurance or whomever only give them 15 minutes to see each patient. That causes so many problems.

I used to call my PCP and book 2 appnts back to back so I would have more time with her, but I digress.

[Mark N]

Kathi, my point is that she was not handling this well but at least she was letting you set the taper schedule because I would trust your research on the proper weaning. As you go into greater detail about her reaction it is hard to believe she took the stance she did. You are right that she should be more responsible for meds she prescribes. I can't imagine screwing up the taper so bad with your chart in front of her. Whatever she had going on she needs to be able to focus on her patient during the time of the appointment.

This is just another example of why we need to be responsible for our own care. We can't always be sure that our doctors know everything about our case even though they should. I hope the taper goes well for you.

[alex44]

Kathi - the fact that you had to go to the ER sends up resd flags about this doctor. IF I were in your position, I would A. Find another doctor - Yes I know how difficult this can be, Most that I have seen recently since moving to Arizona have been needle jockey's - If I could name names I would but I will save that for thye bad doctor boards - not sure it is allowed here so I won't. B. After finding a new doc, I would see a lawyer - her sending you into withdrawels is probobly enough in itself but everything else you have had to suffer through, I admire your fortatude. Good luck and keep posting.
Zax44

[Kathi49]

Thanks SmithC, Mark and Alex, :)

I want to respond to each of you but I was pretty busy today and am now just too tired out. I'll write more in the morning but just wanted to say thanks. :)

[slipnslide]

Kathy,

I've been away from the boards lately but logged on tonight and saw this post. From what you said, I get the impression that she is intimidated by your knowledge of the medications and tapering schedules. Her response to you comes across as though she was annoyed by your questions. I had a similar bad experience with the first Neuro I had seen and refused to ever go back to someone that would not take the time to give me with a truthful/well thought out opinion. I know you've been seeing this Neuro for a while now, but it might be time to switch to someone who is going to listen when you tell them something, and not waste your time with uncaring responses. I found a Neuro I like, even though I disagree with what meds he thinks I should be on, he at least listens to what mecidal complaints I have, and actually does a "true exam" of reflexes, strength, ROM, and pin prick tests, whereas the other Neuro did none, but wrote them in his notes as if he had. I guess my question to you is, is she truly treating you medically as a doctor should?

Kim

[Kathi49]

Okay guys and gals....now I am fairly alert and not so tired. ;) Yesterday was hectic as I had someone over to assist in prepping in the closing my pool; plus, did some minor yardwork with my husband.

SmithC, I think you nailed it because she was running behind. That's usually not the norm and I can even give the docs a one hour grace period. But two hours was too much for my backside to take. ;) So, I was a hurting puppy by the time she got in there. And yes, Klonopin withdrawal/tapering IS serious.

Mark, oh, I understood what you mean now. :) And basically you are right. She should have taken a bit more time. And just for the heck of it and referencing what Alex wrote I looked up her ratings. Four patients wrote pretty much the same thing....not focused and/or not attentive. And that's pretty much what I ran into. But I haven't written anything although I feel like it.

Alex, the withdrawal deal happened awhile back. After that happened she said she couldn't believe it and that my Central Nervous system was very jacked up. I AM sensitive to meds so to be fair, I think the quarter cut was probably too much at the time. And that's why I told her I wanted to go very slowly and in smaller doses this time around. Which is why she was okay with the wafers. And btw, I have found a Neurologist/Psychriatist that appears to be pretty good so I am planning on giving him a call. I just want a second opinion and maybe he would have a different take on this. Oh, and I should say she doesn't give injections that I know of. From what she told me in the past she refers people out to the very spine group I already go to. Oh, and what I am really unsure of is adding Abilify. Once again, she didn't really explain her reasonings for that. So, yep, I want a second opinion.

Kim, lol, I don't think she was intimidated by me at all. But when I mentioned a Valium crossover and from READING about it, that seemed to tick her off. Yep, another doc saying we shouldn't read! I have no problem with not believing everything you read and I have said that before. But do NOT tell me not to research or rather read up on anything! :mad::) Okay, so once again and I am trying to be fair. She HAS run every test under the sun and has gone above and beyond. It just seems that in the past year she has made some pretty snarky responses and really, for no reason. One time I just happened to mention, because SHE brought up Pain Management, that my PM was really good and I liked him a lot. She got real hateful and said, then have him do all of this! So, it is snarky stuff like that. When she did say that, I gave it right back and said, no, YOU are the one that is responsible for the meds YOU prescribed. What I REALLY think is that she wants to treat the "easier" cases. That's the impression I get. Or, maybe her kids or her husband were on her last nerve. :D I know everyone, including docs can have bad days. But she is having too many of them. But you are right it is the uncaring responses I get from time to time when I am just really asking questions in an attempt to understand it all. In any case, you bet! I am calling this other guy. From what I understand he is very attentive and his ratings look great. So, if I like him, I will probably just switch over.

Okay, and last but not least. Thank God for Pharmacists! :) I took my bottle to be refilled and the new scripts. And explained the WHOLE thing! When I told them that I am supposed to "figure this out myself", I am not kidding, they both literally jumped back. As in...say what???!!! And I said, yep, I am supposed to figure this out myself. So, the head Pharmacist explained it all and told me precisely how to go about it. At least he took the time. Even so, I am still making an appointment with this other Neurologist because I will need a new one anyway it looks like.

[slipnslide]

Kathy,

I'm glad the Pharmacist was able to help you. That is who I'd put my trust in when it comes to medications, reactions, and withdrawls.

[Karenica]

Kathi, I agree the pharmacists I think are better with drug info then the docs are. I think your doc had a bad day, was in a hurry and quick to rush you out. If I got treated like that from a doc I would blow my top.
Karenica

[Kathi49]

Thanks Kim and Karen, :)

The Pharmacists, both of them, were very helpful. They have been there forever it seems like and are always very kind...just saying they are very familiar with my conditions/meds. Soooo, I will pick these up today. I do want to find out more about Abilify though.

Karen, I came close to blowing my top. But figured okay, fine, if I am supposed to figure this out on my own I can do that. I will just ask the Pharmacist and seek out another Neurologist. :)

And ya know, I don't want my posts to come across as I was "right" and she was "wrong". Far be it from me to be a doctor. But she should have taken the time to explain and figure it all out and just didn't. So, yeah, I think it is time for me to move on if she is going to continue to act that way.

[Smithc]

It seems odd to me as most docs LOVE for their patients to get off meds when possible. Think she would be encouraging you.

Well maybe she was having a bad day or 2. Definately check out the other doc b4 you change. A doctor who knows your history is a big plus and I would not leave her unless you really need/want to.

Lots of doctors have cruddy bedside manner. What is important is if the doctor is good.

[Kathi49]

Thanks SmithC,

You got me to thinking. :)

You are right...she has my history and actually wrote some very nice and thorough notes as I went through disabiity and well, over a period of 5 years or so. At the time I had no clue what she was writing until I actually received all the notes after awarded. Anyway, I did start to make an appointment with another Neurologist but was told they are not accepting chronic pain patients at this time. Yeah, I know I could have received a second opinion on the tapering bit but my Pharmacist pretty much straightened me out on that. Although I still don't know why my Neurologist wants to add Abilify; I would assume to help with any intrusive thoughts or something like that...easing withdrawals I would imagine. In any case, I STILL feel that she should be accountable as much as myself since she prescribed it. So, I will just go forth and see how it goes. I just hate the thought of ping ponging back and forth too....meaning seeing one Neuro after the other.

And you are right about bedside manner. I had to laugh at that. My own NS can be very abrupt since he is strictly business most of the time. But he is darn good! :) The only difference is...he isn't flippant and she is. :rolleyes:
I guess you could say I am just hurt; probably moreso than being out and out mad.

[Mark N]

Kathi, how is the taper going? I hope after all this that you aren't in bad shape while tapering.

[Kathi49]

Mark,

Thank you for asking. I am starting it tonight. Mainly because I had to wait on the wafers; they had to order them. But also because the last few days have been hectic and my husband was out of town. So, tonight it is. Anyway, we started in on closing our pool yesterday (takes a couple of days). It's done and not really what I would call hard work....just time consuming. And, well, you know how it is when working together with your spouse...divorce city LOL! Just teasing, husband didn't close it last year so I had to teach/tell him what to do. As I have said before, he is an intense person...wants things done yesterday. And you can't rush something like this. Oh, and when we put the NEW cover on, it was too small to be effective. You don't want to know how DH went off LOL! No, not at me...just aggravated. So, yeah, I definitely needed to stay on my same dose for the last couple of days LOL! :)

PS DH is a good guy, don't get me wrong. But don't ever put up a Christmas tree with him either LOL! Boy, I sound terrible. What I really mean is...he is more book smart than he is mechanically inclined...that's all I really mean.

[Mark N]

Kathi, I understand about a spouse. I hope the taper goes well for you and you don't suffer from WD. At least you have the pool closed up so that job is out of the way. I have it set up now that my wife has something else to do when I have a job to do. I can only do this for so long though as we will have an empty nest in a couple of years. I hope you have a good week with this taper.