I see my dr for follow-up on B12 tomorrow

[MotherMoon]

Overall, I have two decent (not great or normal) days after an injection. By day 3 I am tired. By days 4 and 5, I can barely stay awake until the end of work. I have not started the Methyl sublingual until I have another blood work up tomorrow. I will be taking them as soon as I walk out the door. I plan to do 5000 mcg a day for a while. I may stay there or decrease to 1000 a day and see how I do. Here is a rundown of the tests I want him to do.

homocystine
methylmalonic acid
folate
ferritn
potassium
B6
antibody tests for perietal cells and intrinsic factor

I also plan on getting my exact #s on thyroid, celias and cholesterol. I

Any other suggestions?

Oh, depression is becoming a big issue. I am really down mixed with easily angered (not a good combo for a mother of little girls (or boys for that matter)). I have been on Paxil before and did not do well on it and terrible weaning off. I really do not want to do that again. I have heard good things about 5-htp. I am wondering about that. But, I am also wondering if anything will help until my B12 levels are up some. Any ideas?

Thanks
Michelle

[rose]

Even if you had low homocysteine or methylmalonic acid due to B12 deficiency, chances are it/they would be normal now. Remember that does not mean they were normal before, because the doc is likely to think it does.

If methylmalonic acid is not normal, it is likely due either to the further need for B12 and/or kidney problem. A high methylmalonic acid due to B12 deficiency can normalize long before an optimal level of B12 stores is achieved.

Homocysteine can be in the high half of normal or even high out of range because of too little B12, B6, and/or folic acid. So this is a good test to have to see whether you have already gotten it down to lower half of normal or can do so with further supplementation.

The ferritin is important regarding what you can "help" until (and after) your B12 levels are up. If it shows that your iron stores are not optimal, chances are good that they will become lower when the B12 is up and the body begins the hardest work of repairs. Very important now and for the long range.

Also, eat plenty of potassium-rich foods.

The B6 test may not be accurate. I would try to get a B complex that contains the P-5-P type of B6, just to cover the possibility that you cannot use pyridoxine hcl.

Your mood problem may improve a great deal over much time, simply due to getting that B12 up and keeping it up. What you describe is common with B12deficiency, and it may improve noticeably over weeks, months, or even years, depending on how long your brain has been struggling. And often that is WAY longer than we realize.

I would also take a good B complex, fish oil, consider SAMe (check mrsdoubtfyre's writings), look into L-carnitine, and maybe enzymes. And this time of year (especially) consider vitamin D.

Make sure to get a copy of the actual lab results and ranges. And I will smile as I picture you popping that methylcobalamin on the way out of the lab.

Best wishes,

[MotherMoon]

Thanks Rose. I will report in tomorrow. I wish they did the test on site. Unfortunately, they only draw blood for a 'central' processing center. I won't find out for 10 days or so if my b12 went up, or results on any of the other tests he might order tomorrow.

[MotherMoon]

I saw him. I am a bit disappointed. He says I should be feeling better, that my B12 levels should be right and it must be something else -- depression, most likely. He is retesting my B12 but does not want me to continue my shots until we see the results. If they are up, he wants to skip a month and retest to see if they drop. Huh? He is testing for Lyme disease. I do not remember getting a tick bite (they are common here). My girls have. Beth had one just Sunday. He also thinks I need more sleep and need a change in routine. He thinks I should give Sam some Tylenol PM (if it is made in children's) to help her get to sleep earlier for a while and see if that helps me. Right now, I am sleeping regularly from 10 pm til 5:15 am with some disturbances when Samantha wakes (2 to 5 times a week). I have started her on 5-htp. She has had 3 doses over the week. (It is hard to get into giving her somethign at night when she gets vites in the morning). I did a lot of research before deciding on that course of action. Mainly, I need to find a why to skip naps at school but they are required by law until 1st grade. She is in K.

I am rambling. Anyway, he thinks sleep is a big issue. He may be right but I think the B12 is most important. He also suggested making a change in routine mid-week to break things up. Also, he wants me to get exercise. That'd be great if I felt like it. Desire to do things is a big part of the problem.

I am NOT stopping B12. I started the Methyl 5000 today and will keep with them 1 a day for the 60 that are in the bottle (or was it 30). Then reassess. Shots? I have one refill. I am thinking I will just let it hang for a while. I don't like them, they are not methyl and for the $8 they cost, I can get another bottle of methyl 5000. (Vitamin Shoppe here has methyl 1000 in gum. Cool!)

The multivite I got has a good supply of the other B vites and iron and zinc and D. Not much potassium, looking into that. I don't think Dr believe malabsorption to be a problem since celiac was negative and I am not having diarrhea. I feel it is. Darn, I forgot about testing calcium. My thyroid was 2.4, celiac was average to high but in the normal ranges.

I gotta work. More as I remember it.

[rose]

Of course, there could be something else, and it is good that the doc wants to look. But to assume (as so many do) that once the B12 levels are normal again one must be miraculously healed, or even feel better, is not a good assumption. And it is very common for potassium to dip when B12 treatment begins, and iron for a longer period of time. Neither of those deficiencies make a person feel good.

I am happy that you have a doc who would even think of thyroid or lyme. Good! However I see common myths in your post. 1) Thyroid is unlikely but has not been ruled out: testing T3 and T4 would be good. 2) Celiac may not show in the test and diarrhea is not necessary for celiac/gluten sensitivity of other types of malabsorption. They celiac and other malabsorption myths are legion, and most of the "typical" symptoms are not present in most or many experiencing the disorders.

How about ferritin?

Being low in D could account for a mood problem too, and likely your vitamin does not contain the best kind or enough.

I would be leary of methylcobalamin in a gum. You want the dose all at once.

rose

[nopain]

He says I should be feeling better, that my B12 levels should be right and it must be something else -- depression, most likely.

And you are not, but he says you should be so make it so :)

Depression is a diagnosis of exclusion when they can find nothing else. It is not uncommon for people who are ill to be depressed. But for these people depression is a SYMPTOM. Loading up on anti-depressants is every Doctors solutioin these days because that is what they teach in Med School. And there is tons of money to be made selling these supposedly harmless drugs.

If you are using 5-HTP that should be enough to give you an indication as it is a much better way to boost your Seratonin Levels (which is what anti depressants do) and see.

If your state has Natropaths you should consider finding the very best one you can and have them do bloodwork too. You don't need to discuss your current Doctor with them. And I am NOT suggesting you leave your current Doctor. What I am suggesting is you find a different Kind of Doctor who is experienced with Nutritional Problems and give them a shot at their own completely independant diagnosis. Natropathic Physicians as you know can not prescribe drugs so you have little to lose but you may gain new insights as to what is going on. You may have to pay out of pocket for the Naturopath but it could very well be worth it to get to the bottom of a problem which it appears you do not yet have a diagnosis.

Keep with the sublingual B12 as you want it absorbed directly into the bloodstream, just swishing it around in your saliva and washing it down your digestive tract is not a solution. There is no point in taking vitamins that will not be absorbed. 90% of synthetic vitamin supplements pass through the body unabsorbed. Look to as much good wholesome food containing the vitamins you need as possible, as in the food form 60 to 70% of the vitamins are absorbed. Assuming you don't have absorbtion issues.

[rose]

You may as well take the B12 sublingually, but as long as large enough doses are taken at one time, swallowing is fine. And if you malabsorb severely, a smaller dose do you little or no good regardless of whether you dissolve it under your tongue or swallow it.

rose

[MotherMoon]

Ok, update. My darn tooth (gum actually, not the tooth) is infected again. Abx are helping but not like last time. However, I have seen my energy increase some since starting abx. But, the gum is not much better. I go back to the dentist tomorrow.

I have to look at my multi to see which D it has. Ferritin? It has been nearly a week, I am not remembering. I am going to be calling them about the infection in my gum. It may be greatly effecting me and I want them to know about it.

I am going to start the 5-htp. Meant too but it has been a whirlwind weekend.

Naturopaths don't practice in AL, especially in this area. We have has some of the highest jury awards in civil suits in the country. Very lawsuit happy.