HELP! How to outsmart a smarty pants?!

[Kristen (ColeysMom)]

How to toilet train the poop-master!?: eek:

I'm at my wits-end! This child has got my head ready to explode with all the different techniques we've employed and all the ways he's found around them!

Bottom line is that he just won't do something until HE has decided it's time to do it...UGH! So how do I convince him that it's time to try to poop on the toilet????

He's toilet trained for peeing (he does it standing up) but just won't try to poop. He wears underpants so he makes a GOOD mess for me to clean up daily! My latest attempt - I've told him that he's going back to pull-ups if he doesn't try to poop on the toliet...he sqauked about that so I put them on him when he messed his pants yesterday...then he decided that he could pee in his pull-up instead of using the toilet...:mad: :rolleyes:

Needless to say he's back in underpants today...so once again he has gotten around my solution...admittedly it wasn't a very good idea, but I'm OUT of good ones!

So now today he's pooped again without letting me know before. :( He's now naked and I'm petrified...I just don't know what to do...he knows when he's going to poop, he knows he needs to sit on the toilet, but just won't try...

I think if he tries and he's successful that that's all he needs to do to get the ball rolling...

Oh, in case you are thinking that I could sit him on the toilet until he goes...well I've gotten this suggestion from a few people...is it a ligit NT option versus ASD? Not sure??? but Coley wouldn't sit on a toilet (or anywhere else for that matter) without purpose for more than 5 minutes! So unless I know it's time that's not going to work...:confused: :confused: :confused:

OMG - what I wouldn't give to have a child that would just once in a while do something just because I asked him to...to just follow directions...and as soon as I type that/think that I want to take it back...I'm so thankful that he has independent thoughts and ideas, and even more thankful that he has the spunk to act on them...but boy it sure does make stuff like this hard, and I'm certainly keenly aware that I NEED to find a way to wrangle him in before he's a teenager...LORDLY!!!!...I'll be in need of serious therapy by then if I don't come up with something...

Anyway back to this particular dilemma...UGH!!! What do I do???? He's just turned 4 yo... any ideas?

KJ

[lacyndarella]

I hate to tell you, but you're really doing great to have made it this far with him at this young an age. Drew is 12 1/2, and I still have to prompt him to go #2. I think your best bet is to start out really slowly, say, having him sit for a minute at a time and work up to longer times. He's just 4 yo, and when you figure the autism, consider what you're asking of him. Accepting that we'll need more patience and time for our kids to go on their own and regulate themselves is just part of the process. Take the pressure off. Have him try several times a day, for shorter periods of time, and slowly increase the time. He'll get it.


Good luck...

LIZARD, headin' home from "Nacy's" tomorrow

[Kristen (ColeysMom)]

He is perfectly capable...and has no issues with awareness of his body...this is ALL behavioral...but dealing with the behavior entails outwitting a clever stubborn and spirited child...

I think the ASD issue comes in when the idea of being unclean isn't influencing his actions. Then it further complicates the effort when he will not negotiate or discuss things. I know that sounds ridiculous with a 4 yo...what I mean is that there is just absolutely NO reasoning or molding of ideas with him...it's all about what HE wants!

I just think he has decided not to try because he thinks he cant or something...I think I have to find a way to make him want to try in an indirect way. Generally one time is all it takes for him to learn...he doesn't need lots of trials...he's actually quite impressive in that respect.

does that make sense?

[lacyndarella]

I think the ASD issue comes in when the idea of being unclean isn't influencing his actions. Then it further complicates the effort when he will not negotiate or discuss things. I know that sounds ridiculous with a 4 yo...what I mean is that there is just absolutely NO reasoning or molding of ideas with him...it's all about what HE wants!

That's the autism. That's what it does. The ability to reason--when it does at all--often comes much later for our kids. Even in the highest-functioning kids, it can take much longer, so be patient with him about it. Trying to reason with a 4 yo is, in fact, largely pointless, but particularly when you add even the slightest degree of autism to the mix. Kids with autism have a major problem with egocentricity, so yes, he does think it's all about him and what he wants, and he's likely annoyed with you for not recognizing that.


LIZARD :)

[Mother's Heart]

yeah, it makes sense.

My inclination is to say what it may take is just unending patience on your part, commenting matter of factly, or sadly?, each time that he poops that it's supposed to go in the toilet. I did that for a time...poo goes in the toilet. I took him with me to put it in the toilet every time he had an accident and said, poop goes in the toilet. that seemed to work best for us. Eventually he got the idea and went in the toilet and I said, "Good job. You put the poop in the toilet. That's what you're supposed to do. You go poop in the toilet." Now when he has an accident...which isn't everytime anymore he often helps clean it up. Depends on how cleanable the mess is. If it's a steamcleaner challenge then maybe I do it all alone. But he learns that if he makes a poop mess, (or throwing food, toys etc) that somebody has to clean it up. If not him, then someone else.

Have you tried just telling him firmly that you expect him to go in the toilet?

[mcewen]

oh dear. I'm not generally keen on giving 'advice' as it can come back to bite you later, but here goes anyway.
I'm a great believer in the 'bribery and corruption' method of child rearing [rather an punishment] so -
Assuming it's not a 'control' thing or 'shyness thing' =
1. Find a see through box [that he can't open] and put something in it that he REALLY, REALLY WANTS. Buy some stickers. Explain thoroughly = 1 poop in the right spot = 1 sticker. Decide how many stickers he needs to get the prize [not too many at first as it will seem unobtainable and negate the chance of 'winning.' Dismiss each accident as of no importance - what a shame, oh dear, never mind, better luck next time, sorry you don't get your sticker / prize yet.
Repeat as necessary increasing the number of stickers and decreasing the prize.
2. Find an uninhibited child on a high fiber diet [so that they poop several times a day] Borrow the child for the day. Every time THAT child poops, shower him/her with praise [really over the top] and give them a prize for their tremendous achievement [this is called the spotlight method I think]
Not for the faint hearted.
Let me know how you get on.
Good luck and best wishes
http://whitterer-autism.blogspot.com

[mc4_a]

It's just one of those things where you need to push through even though it's awful at first. He will get the idea, but you're on the right track. Repetition until he gets it.